Lordship Salvation and why it is controversial

Stained glass at St John the Baptist's Anglica...Today we are continuing our discussion about how we hear from God, and if you missed yesterday’s program we shared just some of what the Bible has to say on the topic. But there’s more! Once again, we’ll open this up for discussion and read some of your insightful comments.

And then in part two, we’ll talk about something called “Lordship Salvation.” If you’ve never heard that term before, stick around because it’s a very controversial topic with several opposing views in Christianity.

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3 Responses to Lordship Salvation and why it is controversial

  1. Holly Garcia says:

    I think the biggest misunderstanding, is that people accept a Lordship proponent's definition of what Lordship is in their eyes. Macarthur takes Romans 10 and defines that as total submission to Him as Lord. And if we do not agree with His position, then we have "rejected" His Lordship.

    That is simply not true. Jesus is Lord, period, the end. Pretty simple. Men make things complicated when they ought not (2 Cor 11). Take Roman's 10:9 for example:

    That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

    Macarthur submits that this is speaking of making Him Lord of our life. "If He is not Lord of all, He is not your Lord at all", Macarthur says (or something similar)

    But this is a capitalized masculine noun being used here, and means, "God the Messiah". Do we confess that and did we believe that Jesus is the Messiah? Absolutely. He IS Lord, and if we are born again, we will submit more and more if we abide in His Word thereby being sanctified by the truth.

    But to define it as submission to Him as master over everything in our lives, well, somebody out there is fibbing, if they can say they did that when they first believed. Or still fibbing if they say they are doing that now. We have not attained…

    The epistles are there for a reason, to teach us how to walk worthy. Macarthur states that James 4:6-10 IS the gospel. Really? Hmmmm… see vs. 5 and 11 to read in context. Shame on him for adding to the gospel, these were believers being admonished for being doubleminded. How does a non-believer cleanse his hands or purify his heart? (See I Cor 15:1-11 for what the declared gospel is.)

    These men come with wisdom of their words and I can only say, they must not tremble much. I believe they make the cross of none effect as they add requirements to the gospel.

    Paul Washer attacks the "idolatry of decisionism". Although he has some truths in his argument, the title ironically seems to escape the notice of many. To me, it speaks volumes of the method of the enemy in attacking the simple truth.

    We MUST make a decision to place our trust in Him, (believe) and so we know the enemy will attack the simple truth. We indeed receive Him, (Jn 1:12), so Washer mocks "accepting" Him. Semantics…. The synonym for accept IS receive.

    We choose to believe in Him based on knowledge of the truth….Washer chooses his proof texts to say other wise. (we can't believe unless regenerated first). He comes to dwell in our hearts by faith (Eph 3:17) so Washer mocks "asking Him into your heart", (and again, truth to the fact that the only requirement to salvation is true belief) but not according to these men.

    I can only say, I do not believe either man has accepted God's testimony of His Son. Perseverance of the Saints (the P in TULIP) is synonymous with Lordship salvation (according to Macarthur). It is NOT eternal security. It is only eternal security to those who persevere until the end. (You can NEVER know says John Piper whether are saved), another man who seems has not received God's Testimony and record of His Son, making Him a liar.

    If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

    He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

    And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

    He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

    These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have(echō) eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. I John 5:9-13

    If people do not open their eyes to the danger of this reformed thinking, I truly believe it will cost people their souls eternally, and it has corrupted the simplicity that is in Christ.

    I know this will not be a popular response, but I pray someone will see…


    • Mr Davis says:

      Holly you have these folks wrong. They are not at all saying they believe in a works based salvation but a salvation that produces fruit in our lives meet with repentance, which, by the way is an ongoing process as we grow in our knowledge of God. There should be evidence of the fruits of the Holy Spirit increasing in our lives we live in this body, as we walk with Christ Jesus, for we will desire to become more like Him, more and more.

      I do have to agree with you on one point we do make things complicated, we also have the habbit of not accepting the truth. There is nothing you can do to save yourself. When you realize this you cry out to God to save you and you wait, hoping in His mercy. You cannot demand anything. Who are you compared to Him. He is just to destroy you because you have rebelled against Him. The wages of sin is death and all have sined and fallen short of the glory of God.

      When He grants you mercy and aquits all your sins, you will know it for Grace comes in and He makes you His child. He will give you a new heart, a heart of flesh and He will take out your heart of Stone. He will give you a new Spirit "The Spirit of Promise", He will write His Law upon your heart "The Law of Love, which is the Law of Grace and is ever more perfect than the OT Law for the Law of Love does no harm to anyone but seeks what is best for them". He will cause them to Obey it and He doesn't do this for your sake but for His Great Namesake and He will cause His Name to be vindicated in you. Ezekiel 36

      The result of all this, is a walking in repentance, and seeing that your ways are not good, none of them, and our desire is not to continue in them any longer. You will be shocked by your own sinfullness and you will cast yourself at Christ's feet that He may cleanse you and make you suitable for His service. For you will grow to understand you cannot and will not cleanse yourself. You will grow to hate yourself for your own wickness, it will not be a light thing for you to sin. You will grow to see yourself as a utter abonination desperately in need of a Savior and the grace that comes by the very Hand of God. You will see your very life is in opposition to Christ, so much so, you will cry out that you may suffer for His great Namesake Christ Jesus, even to the point of death just to be rid of it: this body of Death.

      You will learn to test all things you do and hear to see if they are according to the Scriptures, for you will trust in the Scriptures as the very commands of the Father of Lights by Whom you have been purchased through Christ Jesus by His Blood. And God will set your heart on them for it is the one He gave you.

      If you think believing is merely mental accent to the truth, then the Devil must be saved for even the Devil and all his minions (demons) believe there is one God and they do one better. They shudder at the thought. see James 2:19

      I really don't think you believe this but that is how you come accross.


  2. Mr Davis says:

    I heard people say you must make Jesus Lord of your life. Really? He's not Lord already that you have to make Him Lord.

    The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. John 3:35-36 Christ Jesus is Lord!!!.

    Now I understand what people mean by this "you must make Him Lord of your life" to say you must submit to Him as Lord.

    But really there is no difference between these two views the person is the one who needs to do something and can do something about his or her condition.

    This isn't the teaching of Scripture. This is the teaching of the culture that belives you can will to do good when scripture is clear you cannot and more importantly will not.

    When you think what you do is good you are really taking on God almighty's holiness and righteousness for only God almighty, maker of Heaven and Earth and all that is in them, He alone is Good!

    Jesus Himself testified to this Mark 10:18 KJV
    And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

    This is why it says in For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither
    cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God. John 3:20- 21 This is the ministry of the Holy Spirit in and Through us.

    And again
    Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Phillipains 2:12-13

    Our acting out of Love as defined in 1 Corinthians 13 and Galatians 5 is the indication of the Holy Spirits work in and through us. All other acts though outwardly they may seem good are really wood, hay and stubble and they will be revealed for what they are by fire. 1 Cor 3

    Now if God is not with us and in us, we are not with Him and we have a big problem.

    But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. We are still under condemnation.

    And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

    Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God , and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Romans 8:9-17


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